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Author Topic: A sad day for Saturn  (Read 772 times)

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sad_rocc

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A sad day for Saturn
« on: February 18, 2009, 10:21:50 AM »

Off to car heaven: Saturn, Saab, Hummer
Posted Feb 17 2009, 09:35 PM by Des Toups Rating:  Filed under: economy, cars
Say goodbye to Saturn. And Saab and Hummer, for that matter. Pontiac, too, for all intents and purposes.

Unless buyers (a few million of us -- or maybe just a couple of really adventurous billionaires) step forward, three of General Motors’ eight brands are now destined to join Oldsmobile in the history books. A fourth will be relegated to “niche” status, says GM.  The company, until last year the world’s largest automaker, announced plans Tuesday that would drastically scale back its operations in order to stay alive.

Production of Saturn cars would stop in 2011 if the brand hasn’t been sold, GM said. Execs will decide whether to pull the plug on Hummer at the end of March, though rumors of Chinese interest have emerged (and been discounted) several times. The company says Saab will be an “independent business entity as of Jan. 1, 2010.” Take that to mean “dead” unless a reluctant Swedish government can be convinced to step in. Pontiac will emerge as a “highly focused niche brand” sold through Buick and GMC Truck showrooms.

All necessary steps, for sure. And insignificant, compared with the long-term future of the workers who make them and the towns that depend upon them.

Yet we’ll mourn these brands even if we won’t miss them.

Who'll be writing songs about Hyundais?

Pontiac was long General Motors’ coolest brand, its Firebird, Grand Prix and Bonneville as hip and relevant in their heydays as any BMW or Honda today. Its GTO was the first true muscle car, its Trans-Am the only legitimate reason to watch “Smokey and the Bandit.”

Saturn once represented hope for a new way of doing business at General Motors, with distinctive plastic-bodied cars and a warm, almost nurturing sales environment. For a time, its “Different Kind of Car Company” shtick worked: Its Homecoming gatherings in 1994 and 1999 drew 75,000 visitors to Spring Hill, Tenn., for a lost weekend of plant tours, country music and sheer differentness.

Hummer? While they might feel as outdated as a coonskin hat, they’re still a lightning rod for eco-terrorists (cops, too) and a raised middle finger to everybody in a Camry. At least you know where a Hummer driver stands, right?

There was a time when Saabs were charming – ugly, obstinate and tough as hell --  but that came long before General Motors entered the picture in 1990. Its offerings today: rebadged GM generics with the ignition switch relocated to the floor.

For good or bad, GM has chosen its horses: Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick and GMC. Would those be yours?

Too early for going-out-of-business sales

Don't expect a fire sale on doomed brands. There already is one, or close to it.

Once factories begin to be shuttered, the balance of supply and demand begins to tip the other way. Don't wait too long. (If you're curious, you can check out the current offerings from Saab, Hummer, Saturn and Pontiac at MSN Autos.)

GM expects its dealer count to fall from 6,246 in 2008 to 4,100 by 2014, mostly in metro and suburban markets. What it will cost GM to disentangle itself from a politically powerful dealer body wasn’t specified, but it spent more than $1 billion earlier this decade to shut down its 2,800-dealer Oldsmobile division.

GM was the largest U.S. corporation by revenue as recently as 2000. GM held 50% or more new-car sales for decades, peaking at 55% in 1956.  In 2008, that figure fell to less than 22%. Market capitalization peaked at $52 billion in 2000. Tuesday, after GM revealed its survival plans, that figure was $1.33 billion.

Whatever your feelings about Hummers, General Motors or cars in general, it's an astounding fall.
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sad_rocc

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2009, 10:27:31 AM »

http://blogs.moneycentral.msn.com/smartspending/archive/2009/02/17/off-to-car-heaven-saturn-saab-hummer.aspx

I think Saturns are great cars, especially in the salted northeast. No dents, no rust, easy to repair and they're solid, reliable little cars that get pretty good mileage. I test-drove a small wagon with a manual and loved it. I know a few people with Saturns and they all rave about them. I think it was a big mistake for them to totally ignore the brand after making it quite successful and I think it's a big mistake to drop them now.

Saab I'm sad to see go. So much history there, but I hear the cars are not like they were in the '80s. I know they still look pretty luxury and they still have sweet interiors, but that's about all I know.

Hummer going is kinda a given. Pontiac turning into a niche brand and being sold at GMC truck dealerships seems kinda odd, I don't know what that's supposed to me.
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Scott

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2009, 10:43:09 AM »

easy to repair and they're solid, reliable little cars that get pretty good mileage.

As a former Saturn owner, and a person who has worked on several of them, I am calling bullshit to this statement.  If you are talking about little things like spark plugs and regular maintenance items... yes you are correct, but when you get into things like alternators or other mechanical bits, these cars become a MASSIVE nightmare.

You are correct on them being reliable for the most part, but when they break... holy crap are you in for a ride!   I owned a 94 SL2 from brand new until I sold it with 112,000 miles on it.  I had to change the alternator, fuel pump, and brake lines all in the last 30,000 of it's life, but the clutch was still stock when I sold it... and for those of you who saw me drive that car, that is a shocking fact! 
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punkrider99

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2009, 10:52:35 AM »

scott is crying in a corner somewhere right now.
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Barry

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2009, 12:11:17 PM »

scott is crying in a corner somewhere right now.

LOL
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Scott

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2009, 12:16:15 PM »

scott is crying in a corner somewhere right now.

Not even in the slightest... did you even read what I wrote above?
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sad_rocc

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2009, 12:21:18 PM »

I meant easy to repair in terms of body damage. Nobody I know with a saturn has had to replace the bits that you mentioned so I dunno about how hard that is.
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punkrider99

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2009, 01:55:03 PM »

scott is crying in a corner somewhere right now.

Not even in the slightest... did you even read what I wrote above?

yeah i was surprised that you composed yourself so well after such tramatic news.  was it hard to see your monitor through all the tears?
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Southcross

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2009, 02:29:20 PM »

Saturns have been the ONLY GM product I've actually liked... quite sad
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sad_rocc

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2009, 03:00:54 PM »

Looking over the lineup of what they're keeping, Saturn's also the only line they had that had any uniqueness to it. They're keeping saturn till 2011, so maybe something will change by then. I'm surprised there have been no buyers, all that brand needs is some attention paid to it.
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scurvy_bandit

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2009, 06:23:31 PM »

I liked the new Opel **AHEEEMMM*** I meant saturns, but oh well. I agree with almost everything they are doing except making Pontiac a niche brand. I still think they should stop the damn GMC's..fuck.

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MileHighAssassin

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2009, 10:29:20 AM »

I really like the H3, and the H2 actually sold really well, that was until gasoline started costing more than blood.

Saab needs to go, I would like to see GM carry over a couple Saturn vehicles, elsewhere.  Pontiac, I was never really sold on, you can usually get the exact same car from Chevrolet.  I have heard rumors that GM will retain the rights to the H3 and badge it as a Chevy.
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thf944

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2009, 10:35:20 AM »

I would like to see GM carry over a couple Saturn vehicles, elsewhere.  Pontiac, I was never really sold on, you can usually get the exact same car from Chevrolet.  I have heard rumors that GM will retain the rights to the H3 and badge it as a Chevy.

i agree. the astra is actually a cool car for gm to have in america. they should sell it as a chevy or pontiac. the h3 was the only hummer that made sense. it would be nice to see it live on as well, maybe they'll make that h3 pickup thingy after all.
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formulanerd

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2009, 02:10:16 PM »

the astra could definitely be a hot hatch if they worked on it a little.
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VWO4L

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2009, 01:54:16 AM »

maybe they'll make that h3 pickup thingy after all.

They are building it.  I've seen a few of them over the past couple of weeks.  Makes much more sense than the ridiculous H2T with its useless bed.
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VWO4L

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2009, 02:06:31 AM »

the astra could definitely be a hot hatch if they worked on it a little.

Wouldn't even require much work, they just need to import it.

The Opel Astra OPC held the N-Ring class record before the Cobalt SS took it.  They share engines, except the OPC got 240HP instead of the 260HP of the Cobalt.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcH8NLbpmzY
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Jesus

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2009, 05:00:10 AM »

the astra could definitely be a hot hatch if they worked on it a little.

I agree.. I actually looked at a few of them when they first came out and they're just plain boring.  Lot's of potential being wasted
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scurvy_bandit

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2009, 07:28:42 AM »

Also if they changed up the ergos a little on the solstice or skyit would be great! That huge rear view mirror in that tiny windshield sucks, and so do the side mirrors. Oh well...
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formulanerd

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2009, 08:48:07 AM »

the astra could definitely be a hot hatch if they worked on it a little.
Wouldn't even require much work, they just need to import it.

what do you mean they need to import it? the saturn (opel) astra is on the streets now.

and by work on it a little, i mean mostly the looks (though the interior isn't half bad for GM)


and i hope whomever photo-shopped this doesn't work for GM

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sad_rocc

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2009, 10:14:56 AM »

Ugh! I've seen people do that sorta shit to saturns and it boggles the mind. Mainly those SUV saturns. Look, the car is already plastic, it doesn't need any more slapped on it. Speaking of which, if they just left saturn to build on it's image of small, reliable, cheap and dent/rust-free cars they may have been ok. Does anyone look at saturn and say Damn, now that's who I want to buy a 2-seater sports car from! Same with the SUV's. I think GM has their bases covered when it comes to sports cars and suvs. Every one of their brands does not need to cover every segment of the market.

Screw the astra tho, when it comes to hot hatches I want a Fiat 500 Abarth SS. So very badly. Best news is with some increased income, I soon will be able to! Fiat might possibly be coming to the US at Mini dealerships.
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formulanerd

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2009, 10:57:44 AM »

i wouldnt categorize that as a hot hatch, though i've been watching them for some time (the fiat)... i'd like one.


as for the saturn suv argument, i disagree... if i bought any GM suv, it'd be the vue redline.... mainly because the engine ISNT gm, so i know it'd last when GM is gone, honda could still service the engine :D :D. that and its one of the best looking of the bunch (excluding Cadillac, saab)....
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sad_rocc

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2009, 01:50:34 PM »

There's a saab suv? I'm starting to think Chrysler's "niche" marketing of Pontiac simply means they won't make sure there's a minivan, suv, small car, big car, sports car and pickup in their lineup.

The older vues weren't abd imo because they were a little boxy and had a different back end. The '08 models just look like every other non-descript mid-sized suv. I dunno anything about GM motors vs the saturn ones. I just think brands and businesses overall do better when they stand for and represent something rather than trying to be everything.
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formulanerd

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #22 on: February 26, 2009, 02:29:54 PM »

There's a saab suv? I'm starting to think Chrysler's "niche" marketing of Pontiac simply means they won't make sure there's a minivan, suv, small car, big car, sports car and pickup in their lineup.

The older vues weren't abd imo because they were a little boxy and had a different back end. The '08 models just look like every other non-descript mid-sized suv. I dunno anything about GM motors vs the saturn ones. I just think brands and businesses overall do better when they stand for and represent something rather than trying to be everything.

actually, i hadn't seen the newest Vue, i dont really like it, so my comment was directed towards the older ones (1 and 1.5 gen).... the 3.6l in the Vue is a honda engine, not GM. (apparently the 08+ may no longer use the honda engine, another reason not to buy)

and yes, there is a saab 9-7x and its gorgeous IMO

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VWO4L

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2009, 05:43:45 AM »

the astra could definitely be a hot hatch if they worked on it a little.
Wouldn't even require much work, they just need to import it.

what do you mean they need to import it? the saturn (opel) astra is on the streets now.

Not the one that qualifies as a hot hatch, that's what part of your post I was referring to.  The 140hp engine in the Astra we get certainly doesn't get my blood a-boilin'
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formulanerd

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Re: A sad day for Saturn
« Reply #24 on: February 27, 2009, 08:34:29 AM »

Not the one that qualifies as a hot hatch, that's what part of your post I was referring to.  The 140hp engine in the Astra we get certainly doesn't get my blood a-boilin'

true, true, but like all saturns, or GM for that matter.... the tame version comes, and then the redline/ss/etc..... if saturns future was secure, there would no doubt be a redline astra with close or the same power as the cobalt ss/tc (what like 260 hp?)
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